Q & A With Mayo's Virtual Cookbook Author

These are just three of the questions we posed to Jennifer K. Nelson, contributing writer to the Virtual Cookbook at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, MN. Nelson is a registered dietitian specializing in applying the science of nutrients to making the best food selections.

What are the five ways you've modified recipes?

There are five basic ways that I modify recipes. And I'll go through them just very briefly, very quickly.

• The first way is to reduce the amount of fat, sugar and or salt. Just right off the top if you have butter in a recipe or you have sugar in a recipe a rule of thumb is that you can reduce it automatically by 1/3 or ? in traditional recipes without sacrificing flavor or texture. If it's already a lowfat recipe then that's another thing. And you can reduce the amount of salt generally by half or you can eliminate it entirely if it's a non-baked good. If it's a baked product you need salt for it to work.

• A second way to modify recipes is to delete an ingredient entirely. And what I look at are recipes where ingredients are used anecdotally such as a condiment or as a topping. For example, does that muffin really need all that frosting? Does that biscotti need to be dipped in chocolate? These are generally optional, although pleasant, ingredients to have. But frequently you can omit them altogether and still enjoy the product.

• A third way to modify recipes is to substitute ingredients; substitute a lower fat item for a higher fat one. An example of this is cream soup. If it calls for whole milk use nonfat milk. Or if you have a fruit salad for example that calls for canned fruit, substitute fruit that has been canned in it's own juice or water packed fruit instead of one that's been canned in sugar sweetened syrup.

• A fourth way to modify recipes is to change the method of preparation. Instead of frying an item, for example fried chicken, bake the item. There are oven-baked fried chicken recipes out there and available. Or for example if something really needs to be fried, don't fry it in oil. Instead use vegetables with a little added water and the vegetables will give off moisture and actually help you saute other meat items, or chicken items, or fish.

• A fifth way to modify recipes is to change the portion size that you're eating. If you have a favorite food, for example your Saturday night homemade pizza, do you really need to eat a half of a pizza or could you get by with a quarter of a pizza? If you're cutting your portion size in half, you're cutting your calories in half, fat in half, and that can be a significant savings as well.

What are some common substitutions you can make in recipes?

When you're modifying a recipe and you're cutting back on high-fat or high-sugar ingredients, frequently what you can do is make some important substitutes. For example, for ? of the margarine or butter in a baked good you could substitute an equal amount of applesauce. So for example if your cookie recipe calls for a stick of butter you can substitute ? of that with applesauce or mashed banana or other pureed fruit of some sort.

You don't have to be limited in whatever fruit you pick. When you're making other substitutes such as for sugar, say you're decreasing the sugar content of a muffin recipe, you can actually enhance the sweetness by using other herbs and spices. For example, add more cinnamon, or nutmeg, or vanilla. It picks up the remaining sweetness that's there and intensifies it. Frequently people don't think of herbs and spices such as that as enhancing sweet flavor but it does.

And then also just a word about the traditional sugar substitutes or the fat-free margarines or butters, or the traditional salt substitutes; these products, unless they're designed specifically for cooking, do not work very well. The heat can change the flavor or the texture and make the food that you're preparing unappetizing so experimentation is the rule of thumb.

What is it about pureed fruit that makes it a good substitute for butter?

When you're using pureed fruit in place of fat, what it's actually doing is fiber that's found in that pureed fruit captures the moisture in the product. It also adds bulk to the product which frequently fat will do. Fat adds moisture. It also adds a more full mouth feel and fruits replace those properties very nicely.

Are there any "rules of thumb" when it comes to recipe substitutions?

Other substitutes that you can make are substituting lower fat ingredients for higher fat ingredients. For example, if you have a recipe that calls for a cream you could use 2% or even skim milk. If you have a product that calls for sugar-sweetened ingredients, use the unsweetened counterpart.

One thing about substitutes be it for fat, sugar, or salt, when you have the ultra light fat substitutes, frequently they are carbohydrate-based or they are egg-based. What happens when you expose these products to heat such as you're going to put the ultra light margarine substitute in the pan (you're going to fry a little piece of fish, or saute some vegetables in it) ? the water in that product will boil off first very quickly, and then the remaining ingredient, if it's egg, you're going to have a little bit of scrambled egg sitting in the bottom of the pan. Or if it's carbohydrates, which is a flour or a dextrose product, you're going to have something very gooey like a flour and water paste in the bottom of your pan. So some of these products don't work well.

Sugar substitutes, think about how many times you've been in a coffee shop where everyone is having their hot cup of coffee and you notice that there are all kinds of sugar substitute packets that are scattered around on the table. Sugar substitutes when they're exposed to heat lose their sweetness. Unless they're designed specifically to withhold heat or withstand heat. And so they don't bake well either. And salt substitutes will change into a metallic taste.

So what we recommend for sugar, salt, and fat substitutes is to use them at the table. Once you get the product to the table if you want to spread a little bit of ultra light margarine on a product, or if you want to add sugar substitute to that hot cup of coffee, or if you want to use a little bit of salt substitute, it works much better.

Cutting calories in food is as simple as...

Cutting calories is as simple as you can make it. I believe that you have to be an educated consumer. You have to know a little bit about cooking. You have to know a little bit about food and what the nutrients are that are in the food, where do the calories come from. Are most of the calories coming from he fatty sauce that's in the casserole? Are most of the calories coming from the sugar-sweetened frosting that's on top of the muffin? And the best way to cut calories are to cut unwanted calories or unnecessary calories, so sometimes trial and error will show you how to make a sauce that's lower in fat, or a topping that's lower in sugar and you can get rid of those unwanted fat and sugar calories.

Do you have a favorite substitution that you use in a recipe or a favorite version of a recipe?

My favorite conversion to make in a recipe is to add things to it. I like to add more healthful ingredients and take away those that might be less healthful. For example on pizza, which on Saturday night is kind of a favorite thing to do. What I choose to do is add more vegetables and more sometimes green products and more fruit. And less of the pepperoni and high-fat meats. Less of the high-fat cheeses and substituting a very- strong-flavor, smaller-amount of cheese such as feta cheese or parmesan cheese and you come up with a great tasting pizza and one that you don't miss those other ingredients.

Is there any thing that would surprise somebody about substituting ingredients?

I think one thing that surprises a lot of the patients when I work with them on converting recipes is how quickly they can learn to modify recipes and it won't destroy the family favorite.

In other words, begin in Minnesota a lot of Minnesotans like hot dishes or casseroles. Things that bake over an hour and they have the family favorite that has the cream of chicken noodle soup or the cream of mushroom soup and what we find is that changing around some of the ingredients the family likes it even better.

It's more up to date, it's more fresh tasting and it might be done in the stovetop rather than in the oven. It might have a lighter sauce or broth rather than a heavier cream sauce. It might have a steamed vegetable rather than one that's baked and wilted. And frequently my patients come back and say I tried this and it really worked and some of those recipes come out of the virtual cookbook as well.

What is the virtual cookbook?

The virtual cookbook actually developed out of requests from individuals for someone to modify their family's favorite recipes into something that could be more healthful. So ? it's a collection of recipes that people have submitted over time that we have reconfigured, changed around in five simple ways to become healthier and more tasty.

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Why is it that we use the same ingredients over and over again?

In our busy new millennium many people have forgotten that they have a kitchen. They are eating out at fast food restaurants. They have hectic lifestyles. Tthey have limited time to cook. I think what many people are finding out is that they're rediscovering their kitchen. They're finding that their older recipes that used to take an hour or an hour and a half to prepare are now converted into those that can be done on a stovetop, in a steamer, in minutes.

There are major appliance companies that are now coming out with new cooking technologies. Cooking with light, cooking with microwaves, cooking with convection ovens, things that can hasten or speed up or make home food healthful fast foods and I think as consumers we are rediscovering our kitchens. We are getting away from those traditional ingredients into a lighter more healthful taste.

What's the worst thing you can get at a burger joint?

Nutritionally the worst thing you can pick is the mammoth-sized super-sized products. They're much more in terms of calories, and cholesterol and fat than we need, than anyone needs in one meal. And we shouldn't be eating only one meal a day. When we're limiting ourselves to those choices chances are we're either over eating at that mall on top of an already satisfying or even heavy day for eating or if that's the only thing we're eating we're limiting ourselves to the nutritional quality of that meal which in nutrition sense means that we're eating high fat, high cholesterol, high calorie.

Should people make some effort to study nutrition?

I think what's becoming increasingly rewarding is that people have a greater awareness of nutrition and it's importance in our food choices and our health. Coupled with that is tons of good information available. Either as a high school student I can find it in my health classes, or as a young adult I can find it in newspapers and magazines. The Wednesday section of the paper, the food section in any number of Health-related magazines or home-related magazines.

And I think as consumers we're becoming more and more aware and more and more informed. Likewise, there's a lot of mis-information out there and it becomes difficult to sort through fact from fiction. But there are excellent web sites out there that are available to learn more about nutrition or you can check with health care providers or you can look for article that are authored by registered dieticians and you can assume that they are factual and that they will help you in you decision making with foods.